> How A Modernist Views the Qur'an. Totally and Thoroughly Kufr

[al-boriqee]

The following remarks about the Qur'an really show a gross ignorance of Islam, even to the point of kufr, because some of the aspects that he talks about falls under "m'alum min ad-deen bi daroora" i.e. knowledge from the religion that is necessitated. I will highlight the complete and total blasphemies. Actually, the whole thing is kufr which made me believe that this dude has to be a kaafir. However he bold is more kufri than the rest

I'll start dead on point - (1)the charm of the Quran has drastically fallen for me since the time I first came across it. I remember getting thrilled by the fact that the language of the Quran is in first person - a criterion I had reached independently on accepting any book as Divine. I also remember getting impressed with the tone of the Quran - the commanding tone, a tone befitting God. While these aspects still hold charm for me, (2)I long for more. (3)I long for the Quran to talk to me.(4) Unfortunately, when I read the Quran I see a rhetoric that is completely alien to my experience. (5)Kaafir and muslim is thrown around in a us-vs-them context. (6)None of that I find relevant. (7)Heck, I'm not so sure about my belief as a muslim, (8)leave alone considering somebody an infidel condemned to hell.
Ayahs after Ayahs talk about grouping against kaafirs, not taking them as confidantes, staying strong against them till the help of Allah comes...all of this seems like a story of people in a different universe, (9)not mine. (10)I am lookng for guidance on staying in control of my nafs - eating only when hungry, eating till I'm almost full but not extended, talking only when necessary, talking with humility etc. I do find these teachings in the Quran, no doubt. But they are far few and spread out. (11)Most of it is about some war in another galaxy in another time. (12)I look for inspiration to make sense of the struggles of life. (13)I do find it there in the Quran, but I find it again few and far between. It is about test, no doubt. After having known these things that are relevant to my life, the rest of the Quran, (14)about 85% of it, seems totally irrelevant. What remains are basic lessons of humility, staying away from evil, contentment and gratitude. (15)I wonder is there anything more the Quran can give me. Life seems all about having these basics going, no doubt. (16)But I find the Quran not talking to me save a little.

How do you talk to the Quran? Pls share.

the numbers above are mine which I inserted there in order to number the amount of kufrs inherent in his post. I lost count after 6 so I had to literally number each point which constituted as a kufr. Maybe in the future I can break down each kufr he exclaimed and highlight how it nullifies a Muslims belief. With each single kufr he could be declared a murtadd. we can literally make takfir of him 16 different times or he is an apostate 16 times over lol.

however, as anyone can see, Im sure after vomiting after reading this garbage, this is what modernism and hadeeth rejection does to a human soul. It corrupts the human fitrah.

I ask Allah to discontinue the spread of this lunacy in our religion and in our lands and that He, the Most High, renders their efforts useless and that their efforts do not continue to harm the ummah ameen

[optimist]

salam,

any person can know it is total kufr what this man is saying...he must be declared as an apostate, instead of hadith rejector or modernist. I owe comments for some your posts, insha allah i will post my comments in a day or two

wassalam

[salman]

^^wa'alayk as-salam

brother if you did not know that hadith rejectors are apostates and so are the modernists because they reject and distort the sharee'ah and want to change Islam. These labels are just used to describe their background/origin/heretical views or where they come from.

jazak Allah khayran for sharing habibi - when you even get the smell of these groups, it is alone enough to drag you to kufr. may Allah Ta'ala save us from this fitnah and guide them or give them what they deserve, ameen.

PS: I have merged the threads since they all have to do with modernists and their heretical views

[al-boriqee]

2 things

well

firstly,

I kinda wanted them separate so that way we can identify and locate each point by their titles for FUTURE reference work and to break down their ideology when we get a chance (others outside of myself) which leads me to my second suggestion which I stated earlier. I think we may have to form a sub forum specifically dedicated to the modernist phenomenon. It will be more easier for reference and will highlight further research into this subject by others.

Secondly

shaykh salman. remember, I stated before that we can't call all modernist kufar and paint them with one stroke of a brush. I highlighted that there are varying levels of their heresy. The lightest of their heresy is that some of them accept hadeeth by they just simply distort or render obsolete some texts that their limited and defunct intellect finds problematic.

they are different than progressives in only one thing. They generally have a slight gheera for Islam and they operate under the realm of revisionism. As for progressives, there is no doubt of their apostasy. Many of them are secularist, if not all as well. For progressives, they have absolutely no shame, if they find something problematic that contradicts their corrupt constitutional reasoning, they are not afraid to reject and boldly claim fault on the prophet or the companions whereas generally most modernist adopt a manhaj of apologeticism. Don't get me wrong, there are some modernist who are definitely out the fold of Islam. However there are varying degrees of them and we have to take those degrees into account which is something that Abu Zubair pretty much stated in his lectures of modernism.

[al-boriqee]

Originally Posted by optimist

salam,

any person can know it is total kufr what this man is saying...he must be declared as an apostate, instead of hadith rejector or modernist. I owe comments for some your posts, insha allah i will post my comments in a day or two

wassalam

Why are you demarcating him and the matter. The purpose of highlighting this ordeal is to show you and everyone else the basic conclusion of what modernism does to the soul of a person. In other words, what this man stated about the Qur'an is nothing short of hadeeth rejection and modernism to its most logical conclusion.

I have dealt with modernist for years. I have not seen any other conclusion other than this coming from them. what modernism does is that it brings the soul on the very brink of open and undefiled kufr of the highest order.